QaF 506 [quinn222]

You're viewing

quinn222's journal
Create a Dreamwidth Account Learn More

Reload page in style: site light

←

→

Cutting

For the most part I've really loved S5. I try and stay positive, even about the things I haven't liked. That said, I hated 506. And I hated Justin in it. I don't like feeling that way but I do. It's as though he's lost every single bit of common sense he has not to mention any knowledge at all of what Brian is like. Brian is telling him how he feels, he's practically screaming out for reassurance and Justin chooses that moment to talk about a house and kids? Has he lost his mind or is he actively trying to end it with Brian?

I'm not saying that he shouldn't want those things, only that he's being really really stupid about how he goes about it.

Oh, and nice to see Troy again but are we really supposed to believe Ted has changed so much that Troy somehow no longer sees him as pathetic?

I'm pretty disgusted but am hoping this is the requisite bad episode for S5. The preview for next week doesn't give me much hope though.

←

→

There are 37 comments on this entry. (Reply.)

De-lurking to say that I agree entirely. The popular opinion seems to be that Justin's behavior is quite rational, but to me it seems out of character.

*Watches episode*

*Watches preview for next week*

*Goes fetal and rocks self rhythmically*

I see them *both* screaming out for reasurrance. What was Justin asking for at the end of 505? When Brian was needlessly and purposefully cruel with his, "And what would that be?" Justin was completely straightforward with Brian tonight about what he wants. Why does Justin have to coddle and console him every time he has a bought of insecurity? Justin is in this relationship too and his needs are not being met, and Brian is making it very, very clear that he has no interest in *ever* meeting them. I guess I just don't understand what's wrong with Justin being very clear about what is bothering him.

I guess I just don't understand what's wrong with Justin being very clear about what is bothering him.

Nothing, as I said in my post I don't blame him for wanting those things or even for asking for them. But his timing could not have been worse. Brian has been there for Justin, this is the first time I have ever seen him admit a weakness to Justin, to tell him he's feeling insecure and that's the moment Justin chooses to push an agenda that he knows Brian is not ready to hear? I thought it was stupid of him.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I think Justin is at the end of his rope and doesn't really care about timing or finagling things out of Brian any more. He's been patient for a very long time and he just looks tired and defeated to me at this point. And sad.

Brian's timing hasn't been the best, either. He has really been off the charts cruel to the people around him lately. Maybe that's a cry for help, but there is also a price to pay for that kind of malicious cruelty, and sometimes its alienating the people who love you.

[link] [parent] [reply]

there is also a price to pay for that kind of malicious cruelty, and sometimes its alienating the people who love you.

That's certainly true. My question is if Justin actually belongs in that category. I haven't seen much sign that he actually does love Brian for a while. I was hoping it was just bad writing that made him seem distant but now I'm not so sure.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Everything he's done since he returned
from Hollywood says: "meal ticket."

And Brian knows it.

No wonder he's acting out.

I guess Mikey needs to read Justy the
Kinney Operating Manual again. Oops --
Mikey lost his copy, too.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Maybe Justin is a little tired of being in a long term relationship with someone who requires an operating manual.

As for being a meal ticket, I guess you'd really have to believe that Justin doesn't love Brian. I think he does. I guess you disagree.

Also, Justin mentioned last night how many copies of Rage have sold. He's made enough off the comic in the past to offer to help Brian with his debt in the beginning of S4, so I think its safe to say he's making some bucks there. I'm sure he still has some money from the movie, and its unclear whether or not he went back to working at the diner.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Everything he's done since he returned
from Hollywood says: "meal ticket."

I'm seeing a lot of things, but this ain't one of them. Care to elaborate?

[link] [parent] [reply]

It's bad writing. Or contrived writing, actually. I won't say more than that. But it is. It's out of character for Justin not to be more loving toward Brian and it's out of character for Brian to be quite this shitty to Justin. It's contrived, plain and simple. The good news is, Gale and Randy are truly making the best out of what they're given.

Trust me. It could be A LOT worse.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Just adding that I agree with your point that neither of them is behaving well. The thing is that both of them have been acting bizarrely for a lot of this season, which I don't really like. It's as though they aren't themselves any more but just walking mouthpieces for Cowlips agenda.

[link] [parent] [reply]

It's as though they aren't themselves any more but just walking mouthpieces for Cowlips agenda.
You've got that absolutely right.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Looks like they are both reading the season two handbook on how not to communicate. IMO they are both behaving selfishly.

On the other hand Harris Allen was awesome tonight. I love how he portrays Hunter's insecurities.

That's Troy. Apparently no one recognizes the same
boring Ted from before he had plastic surgery. Or
that he ran a successful gay porn site. Or that
Channel 5's loveable "Queer Guy" is also Fetch
Dixon, winner of the Crystal Dick Award for Best
New-cummer.

Brandon is supposed to be hot? Is the pool of
guys who will play THAT small that he's the best
they can get? If they gave Brian a decent haircut
and let him wear a color other than shit-brown
I don't think he'd have a problem.

Dennis the Menace is almost as big a prig as
Mikey and Zen Ben. No wonder Hunter wants to
leave home. And they let him walk away. Social
Services will love that. They're Official Foster
Parents, remember? They are monitored regularly
as well as getting money from Social Services.
If the kid books, it's THEIR responsibility.
Oh, well!

I detest this season with the heat of a thousand
suns.

Uh, Gaedhal, re: Social services, you're asking for realism in the writing. It really is too much to ask!

A thousand suns, a couple a galaxies, hell, implode the entire univers, my hatred is right up there in the stars with yours.

I'm not really sure WHY we had any episodes between 218ish and this. Anyone want to fill me in?

[link] [parent] [reply]

Wow. It's funny because I fall on the complete opposite side of the spectrum on this matter.

I think it comes down to whether you tend to prefer Brian or Justin, and since I'm a huge Justin apologist...

I pretty much agree with everything

susanderavish said in her above comment. Justin is being complely honest about his feelings, and Brian has been nothing but condescending and cruel to him for the past two episodes -- even before Mr. Stud showed up (see last scene of 505). I don't know, I feel for Brian, but then again I want to slap him silly because he doesn't seem to realize that he can't be an ass to the people he loves and get away with it.

I hate to say this, but this is the first time in the history of this show that I have ever rooted for Justin to leave Brian. :|

...I feel horrible commenting on this when I never comment on Adventures. I'm an awful person, so let me say now that I read it every day and love it to bits. ;)

I think it comes down to whether you tend to prefer Brian or Justin, and since I'm a huge Justin apologist...

Just to reiterate, I don't think Justin is wrong for wanting what he wants. I just thought he was incredibly stupid to ask for it right at that moment. Regardless of if Brian was right or wrong in his behaviour there was no way in hell that Justin was going to get any kind of response from Brian when Brian was frantically trying on one identical shirt after another trying to reassure himself that he's not over the hill.

It was like saying, "Yeah, you are over the hill and your only option now is a house a dog and 2.5 kids." Not likely to get anywhere with that.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I just thought he was incredibly stupid to ask for it right at that moment.

May be because Brian asked him to move in? May be Justin thought that means Brian's thinking of making changes? Of behaving more like a couple than the guy he fucks more than once?

And that some stranger rejecting him means more to Brian than what Justin thinks and feels.

[link] [parent] [reply]

May be because Brian asked him to move in?

I'm not alking about at this general point in time. I meant at that specific point in time.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I think Justin's always wanted a stronger commitment than Brian. IMO he never give that up. And when Brian asked him to move in, he's entitled to think that Brian's finally ready. And how much longer was he supposed to wait anyway? To settle means to give up wanting more, and I don't think Justin's that kind of person. I think Brian's feeling for Justin is because Justin expects more from him, not like Michael and Lindsay who buy the myth. Justin's young and while Brian may have years to beat every expectations out of himself, surely he can find more sympathetic ways to deal with Justin's more heteronormative expectations? It seems like he's not even trying...

Justin's also been mightily dissappointed from Rage's failure. While Michael has Ben, Hunter and JR to take his mind off this, Justin's the one most affected. Surely, that's effect is going to linger.

And if they aren't prepared to meet each other halfway, they are better off apart (like some people have been saying). But I really think Justin is Brian's chance at love. It's a vicious circle...

[link] [parent] [reply]

Again, I totally agree. What I meant was that specific point in time. Down to the minute. Not in general, not that month. That moment, when Brian was in the middle of a panic was not the right time. I have no objection to Justin wanting those things or to him asking for them. But as anyone who has ever been in a relationship knows you have to pick your time and he picked a really really bad one.

Who knows, give a day or two Brian might have been far more open, now he feels pushed to the wall.

[link] [parent] [reply]

What was it that Justin's asking at that specific point in time?

I think Justin's been building up for this since day one. The syphillis could also be the reason. To know you live so close to that and that Brian told him hours later and planting the idea that he could get it Justin.

For me there are resons everywhere I look.

[link] [parent] [reply]

What was it that Justin's asking at that specific point in time?

House, kids, marriage. Right when Brian was in the middle of a panic attack. Bad bad timing. Even the next morning would have been far better timing.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I have to watch the episode again then. I don't remember Justin asking for those specific things. I remember him asking Brian to act like more of a couple. To open himself to ideas that would mean building a life together.

[link] [parent] [reply]

And that some stranger rejecting him means more to Brian than what Justin thinks and feels.

This hits it right on the money.

Timing is never perfect, but holding things back just leads to more miscommunication and infidelities.

I don't necessarily think Justin should end the relationship (this is such an easy resolution if they'd just both be willing to go one step further for one another), but I was urging Justin to just walk away and not say a word. Not because what he has to say shouldn't be said, but that his silence would speak wonders to Brian.

[link] [parent] [reply]

but I was urging Justin to just walk away and not say a word. Not because what he has to say shouldn't be said, but that his silence would speak wonders to Brian.

And Justin's already being accused of being cold and passive agressive.

I want Justin to articulate his feelings. I don't want him to be another Brian. And Brian has already told Justin to stand up for himself. I think he's been doing exactly that.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Actually, I meant for it to be more of a temporary cold-shoulder at the right moment when Brian can't ignore him (i.e.--the housewarming party; just leave, before Brian got a chance). As we all know, silence isn't a new phenomena for Brian Kinney, but it is for Justin. Remember, Brian's whole dominant mentality: I make the first move; I'm the one on top; I choose you. It's never been the other way around except for, surprise, surprise, his relationship with Justin. This is how it's pretty much always been, but Brian refuses to confront the fact. If Justin simply (and for a brief moment) glanced quickly at Brian before he walked out of the house-warming party, or even didn't mention what he wanted at the exact Brian-queening moment by getting up, putting some shoes on and simply taking a walk or just turning on the TV and falling asleep on the couch. Whatever. Just something nonchalant and stale of all emotion, Brian would definitely notice. If anyone knows when Justin isn't acting like himself, it's Brian.

[link] [parent] [reply]

Brian would definitely notice. If anyone knows when Justin isn't acting like himself, it's Brian.

Justin has been showing his dissatisfaction but it doesn't look as if Brian's noticed. Or may be he simply didn't care.

[link] [parent] [reply]

He doesn't care, at this point. The more I think about it, Brian really wouldn't be as ruthless and all survival-of-the-fittest on Justin if this psuedo-New King of Babylon hadn't appeared.

And, let me just say, he's no replacement.

[link] [parent] [reply]

For us maybe. But Cowlip wants us to think otherwise. Someone mentioned the possibility of Brandon as a symbol of Briab's youth. No matter how hard he chased, it'll never be his.

And then of course, raise the possibility of whether this is really Cowlip's intention all along. Which I highly doubt.

[link] [parent] [reply]

This is where I pray this is going:

1. Justin leaves Brian, but he's tacitly aware of Brian's issues.

2. Hotboy hits on Justin, and Brian realizes it.

3. Justin rejects Hotboy, and goes to Brian.

4. Brian realizes that he has the best, and begins to grow up a little.

That's my little wish for the future. Let's pray Em sprinkles a little magic fairy dust on this wish to make it come true!

While we're at it, let's also hope Michael gets a little less whiny soon. I'm having flashbacks to Dr. David episodes, but Ben is not encouraging this madness.

Reading the posts here tonight, after finally watching this episode, I'm starting to realize a few things. These last few episodes have the same feel to them as the end of S2 - and I'm not liking it any better. Both of them (B/J) need something from the other. But neither of are willing, though I think most definitely able, to give the other what they need.

I was sitting here watching, going 'Hello, is anyone in there? A successful businessman and Mr. 1500-SAT should be able to figure this out, by now!' Boys....

*Though I did love Mel's diagnosis of Debbie's problem =)*

I agree with all of those who laid this all on Cowlip.

While I will love Cowlip forever for giving us Brian and Justin and hot, explicit man-on-man action and a prime time series about gays that isn't neutered, I will also hate them just as long for dropping the ball in the execution.

It is definitely Seasson 2 all over again. And it's so obvious that Cowlip are manipulating the story to the their own ideas/agenda.

Though B/J are the most grievious, they've done it to just about everyone. I've defended Melanie here and elsewhere in part because she has been one of the worse victims. She's their idea of a shrill, vindicative lesbian, and let's not forget how we can use her to make others look better and to move along the plot. Grrrrr.

I often think longingly about what better writers could have done with this show--if the creators had allowed it. But then I just sigh and get back to reality--letting the Brian & Justin and Gale & Radny love get me through the rest.

I've defended Melanie here and elsewhere in part because she has been one of the worse victims. She's their idea of a shrill, vindicative lesbian, and let's not forget how we can use her to make others look better and to move along the plot.

You're so right there. I feel bad for Michelle. They write both Mel and Lindsay so badly that it makes it nearly impossible to care about them or their problems at all.

[link] [parent] [reply]

She's their idea of a shrill, vindicative lesbian, and let's not forget how we can use her to make others look better and to move along the plot. Grrrrr.

Thank you. Just thank you.

[link] [parent] [reply]

I found your slant on episode 506 somewhat different than mine. Particularly where Justin is concerned. I think he is more mature than he's ever been. Please feel free to check out my random thought at my LJ, I'd love to get your feedback.

Sometimes I really want to ask Justin..."WHAT IN THE HELL DO YOU WANT??" He knows what Brian is like, and still....I just don't know sometimes..plus, maybe it's me, but I think that sometimes Justing can be a little, how can I put this, cold (that might not be the right word, but a little less affectionate than Brian)

January